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Re:Question about Analyze moving 06/18 (Wed) 17:20 (no.49)

Thank you for your response.

I am glad that you finally understood my problem:)
I did not get any warning.
I tried to reset my analysing parameters, and analysed again,
then I got a correct resault.
I don't have any problem with my gnuBG, now.

I appreciate your kindness, and I love gnuBG because it is my best teacher!

Thank you,

Mirori


Re:Question about Analyze moving 06/18 (Wed) 17:19 (no.48)

Hello Mirori,

Yes, you are right. I did not look at the moves!!

I cleaned the Analyse of the game you sent (Analysis/Clear Analysis/Match).
Then analysed the game again (just Expert/0-Ply) (Analysis/Analyse Game).

This is the result:
                                      GGraccoon            SpMirori
Checkerplay statistics:
Total moves                           26                   25
Unforced moves                        20                   18
Moves marked very good                0                    0
Moves marked good                     0                    0
Moves marked interesting              0                    0
Moves unmarked                        26                   16
Moves marked doubtful                 0                    6
Moves marked bad                      0                    2
Moves marked very bad                 0                    1
Error rate (total)                    -0.031 (-1.535%)     -0.914 (-28.066%)
Error rate (pr. move)                 -0.002 (-0.077%)     -0.051 (-1.559%)
Checker play rating                   Supernatural         Awful!
Rolls marked very lucky               0                    0
Rolls marked lucky                    1                    0
Rolls unmarked                        25                   25
Rolls marked unlucky                  0                    0
Rolls marked very unlucky             0                    0
Luck rate (total)                     +0.598 (+17.452%)    -0.407 (-9.725%)
Luck rate (pr. move)                  +0.023 (+0.671%)     -0.016 (-0.389%)
Luck rating                           Good dice, man!      None
Cube decision statistics:
Total cube decisions                  3                    5
Actual or close cube decisions        3                    2
Doubles                               1                    1
Takes                                 1                    1
Pass                                  0                    0
Missed doubles around DP              0 (+0.000, +0.000%)  0 (+0.000,
+0.000%)
Missed doubles around TG              0 (+0.000, +0.000%)  0 (+0.000,
+0.000%)
Wrong doubles around DP               0 (+0.000, +0.000%)  1
(-0.392, -10.060%)
Wrong doubles around TG               0 (+0.000, +0.000%)  0 (+0.000,
+0.000%)
Wrong takes                           0 (+0.000, +0.000%)  0 (+0.000,
+0.000%)
Wrong passes                          0 (+0.000, +0.000%)  0 (+0.000,
+0.000%)
Error rate (total)                    +0.000 (+0.000%)     -0.392 (-10.060%)
Error rate (per cube decision)        +0.000 (+0.000%)     -0.196 (-5.030%)
Cube decision rating                  Supernatural         Awful!
Overall
Overall error rate (total)            -0.031 (-1.535%)     -1.307 (-38.126%)
Overall error rate (per decision)     -0.001 (-0.067%)     -0.065 (-1.906%)
Equivalent Snowie error rate          -0.6                 -25.6
Overall rating                        Supernatural         Awful!
MWC against current opponent            86.59%               13.41%
Guestimated abs. rating               2159.96              1202.33

Quite normal analyse that is now.
(I use build 030614, but that can't be the problem)

So, because there are no complains about analysing from other users, and you
do get 'perfect play' with every match you analyse, do you have the correct
weights on your PC?
(when gnubg starts, does it tell you: 'WARNING: No neural net weights were
found'?)

And you can check what databases and weights gnubg is using:
Analyse / Evaluation engine (almost last line of the Analyse submenu).

If you do _not_ get that warning, I propose to reset your analysing
parameters.
Settings / Analyse
Under Chequer play and Cube decisions choose: Expert (or World Class, or
Supremo)
Settings / Evaluate
Under Chequer play and Cube decisions choose: Expert (or World Class, or
Supremo)

Then open a match, clear the analysis and analyse it again?

Please keep me posted if you still have those weird results.

Nardy

> Hi, Nardy,
>
> The file I sent you was I played as worse as I could.
> Please take a look at each move.
>
> Thank you,
>
> Mirori
>



Re:Question about Analyze moving 06/18 (Wed) 17:16 (no.47)

Thank you for your response. I analysed over 20 matches of 9 points of mine. The resaults were all supernatural. It was impossible for me. For example, I don't think this is the best move. GGraccoon (O, 0 pts) vs. SpMirori (X, 0 pts) (Match to 3) Game number 1 Move number 16: X to play 11

 GNU Backgammon  Position ID: sk2LAxCJOXgAbA
                 Match ID   : QolkAAAAAAAA
 +13-14-15-16-17-18------19-20-21-22-23-24-+     O: GGraccoon (Cube: 4)
 | X     O  O  O    |   | O  O  O     O  X |     0 points
 | X        O       |   | O  O  O        X |     
 | X                |   |                  |     
 | X                |   |                  |     
 |                  |   |                  |    
v|                  |BAR|                  |     3 point match
 |                  |   |                  |    
 |                  |   |                  |     
 | O           X    |   |                  |     
 | O           X    | X | X                |     Rolled 11
 | O           X    | X | X        X  O  X |     0 points
 +12-11-10--9--8--7-------6--5--4--3--2--1-+     X: SpMirori
Pip counts: O 130, X 190

* SpMirori moves bar/24(2) 8/6

Rolled 11 (+5.500%):
*    1. Cubeful 2-ply    bar/24(2) 8/6                MWC:  21.97%
       0.220 0.025 0.000 - 0.780 0.516 0.136
     2. Cubeful 1-ply    bar/23*/22 bar/24            MWC:  18.85% ( -3.11%)
       0.189 0.028 0.001 - 0.811 0.496 0.104
     3. Cubeful 1-ply    bar/23* bar/24 8/7           MWC:  17.47% ( -4.50%)
       0.175 0.025 0.001 - 0.825 0.532 0.127
     4. Cubeful 1-ply    bar/23* bar/24 6/5           MWC:  12.75% ( -9.22%)
       0.127 0.006 0.000 - 0.873 0.631 0.201
     5. Cubeful 0-ply    bar/24(2) 8/7 3/2*           MWC:  24.79% ( +2.83%)
       0.248 0.033 0.001 - 0.752 0.480 0.119
Output generated Mon Jun 16 19:29:03 2003 by GNU Backgammon 0.13-devel (Text Export version 1.39) Mirori


Re:Question about Analyze moving 06/18 (Wed) 17:11 (no.46)

Chequer play is indeed supernatural. All moves you made were best moves.

Moves unmarked                   26                      25
Moves marked doubtful             0                       0
Moves marked bad                  0                       0
Moves marked very bad             0                       0
Error rate (total)              +0.000 ( +0.000%)       +0.000 ( +0.000%)
Error rate (per move)            +0.00 ( +0.000%)        +0.00 ( +0.000%)
Chequer play rating             Supernatural            Supernatural
--------------

Cube play however....

Error rate (total)              +0.000 ( +0.000%)       -0.386 ( -9.566%)
Error rate (per cube decision)   +0.00 ( +0.000%)        -0.19 ( -4.783%)
Cube decision rating            Supernatural            Awful!
--------------

And thus the overall statistics show:

Overall statistics:

Error rate (total)              +0.000 ( +0.000%)       -0.386 ( -9.566%)
Error rate (per decision)        +0.00 ( +0.000%)        -0.02 ( -0.478%)
Equiv. Snowie error rate         +0.00                  -12.86
Overall rating                  Supernatural            Casual player

Match winning chance
against opponent                  59.57%                  40.43%
Guestimated abs. rating         2200.00                 1764.29
Estimated FIBS rating           2100.00                  1905.73
----------------
There is nothing wrong with gnubg's analysis. Nardy


Re:Question about Analyze moving 06/18 (Wed) 17:10 (no.45)

> Thank you for your response.
>
> I did "Analyze Match" before asking "Match statistice".
> Cube decision rating and Luck rate look correctly, but only Checker play
rating is wrong.
>
> Mirori

Can you send the .sgf file ?
(not to the list, just to me)

Nardy


Re:Question about Analyze moving 06/18 (Wed) 17:09 (no.44)

Thank you for your response.

I did "Analyze Match" before asking "Match statistice".
Cube decision rating and Luck rate look correctly, but only Checker play rating is wrong.

Mirori


Re:Question about Analyze moving 06/18 (Wed) 17:08 (no.43)

> My gnuBG alwasy shows analysis resault as "supernatural" even if bad move.
> What is wrong?
>
> version0.13-devel(build May 24 2003)
> Analysis settings>Lookahead 2plies
> Evaluation settings>Lookahead 2plies
> Rollouts settings>Lookahead 2plies
>
> Thank you,
>
> Mirori

Did you Analyse Game/Match before asking Game/Match statistics?

Nardy


Mirori says... Question about Analyze moving 06/18 (Wed) 17:07 (no.42)

My gnuBG alwasy shows analysis resault as "supernatural" even if bad move.
What is wrong?

version0.13-devel(build May 24 2003)
Analysis settings>Lookahead 2plies
Evaluation settings>Lookahead 2plies
Rollouts settings>Lookahead 2plies

Thank you,

Mirori


07/09 (Tue) 11:33 (no.24)

>On Mon, Jul 08, 2002 at 02:26:32PM -0700, Orange Design wrote:
>> Suggestion,
>> I think it's more convenience if the copy of board includes score and
>> qube value.
>
>I think it does in later revisions. Try the newest snapshot.
>
>-Oeystein

I downloaded and installed the newest version over the old version.
I confirmed the text board includs score and qube value. It is very nice.

After installed newest version, "Help>about gunbg" dialog shows still version0.12 which as same as before.
Is it ok?

What is "Binary snapshots" on your site?
I downloaded "gunbg-020704.exe", but cannot installed it.
Error message says "not found libgdbm-2.dll".

Thank you

Mirori


07/10 (Wed) 15:34 (no.25)

> After installed newest version, "Help>about gunbg" dialog shows still
> version0.12 which as same as before.

> Is it ok?
Version 0.12 is worked on the snapshots are subversions
>
> What is "Binary snapshots" on your site?

a binary snapshot is just the latest executeble

> I downloaded "gunbg-020704.exe", but cannot installed it.
> Error message says "not found libgdbm-2.dll".

visit http://home.online.no/~oeysteij/
and first download the instalation archieve , this contains dll 's and
other dependcie files.
this is allready a runable version .
If you later download the latest snapshot just copy the exe in the gnubg
folder

Greetings Rob


07/07 (Sun) 22:16 (no.18)

>On Fri, Jul 05, 2002 at 07:22:49PM -0700, Orange Design wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> I'm using GNUBG v0.12.
>> I want to see export position by text format.
>> I try to open Edit>Enter command, then put "set board",
>> but I don't know where I can see the text.
>> Is it possible to see the position of text foramt?
>
>Try Edit->Enter command... and type 'copy'
>This will put a text formatted board in your windows clipboard,
>and you can paste it in in your text editor.

Thank you very much. I got it.
Is it possible to copy to the clipboard for Annotation and Game
recoard?

One more question.
May I copy,past and open all of your email on my webpage?
Then, people who have same question with me can solve it without contacting
you.

Thank you,

Mirori


07/09 (Tue) 06:03 (no.19)

> Is it possible to copy to the clipboard for Annotation and Game
> recoard?

Not right now, buy it's on the TODO list.

> One more question.
> May I copy,past and open all of your email on my webpage?
> Then, people who have same question with me can solve it without contacting
> you.

No problem! You can also also coordinate such things with Achim who
writes and maintain the FAQ and documentation. He subscribes to this
mailing list so he can read this message.

Oeystein


07/09 (Tue) 06:22 (no.20)

>On Sun, Jul 07, 2002 at 08:56:26PM +0900, Orange Design wrote:
>> Is it possible to copy to the clipboard for Annotation and Game
>> recoard?
>
>Not right now, buy it's on the TODO list.

Thank you.
Suggestion,
I think it's more convenience if the copy of board includes score and qube value.

>> One more question.
>> May I copy,past and open all of your email on my webpage?
>> Then, people who have same question with me can solve it without contacting
>> you.
>
>No problem! You can also also coordinate such things with Achim who
>writes and maintain the FAQ and documentation. He subscribes to this
>mailing list so he can read this message.
>
>Oeystein

Thank you very much.
I put link of the mail record page on the top of this page.
http://owd.dhs.org/game/gammon/gnu/

When I was editing this page, I noticed that I asked you same question twice,
about copy command. Sorry about it :p

Thank you, again.

Mirori


07/09 (Tue) 11:10 (no.23)

On Mon, Jul 08, 2002 at 02:26:32PM -0700, Orange Design wrote:
> Thank you.
> Suggestion,
> I think it's more convenience if the copy of board includes score and
> qube value.

I think it does in later revisions. Try the newest snapshot.

Oeystein


07/07 (Sun) 22:15 (no.17)

On Fri, Jul 05, 2002 at 07:22:49PM -0700, Orange Design wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I'm using GNUBG v0.12.
> I want to see export position by text format.
> I try to open Edit>Enter command, then put "set board",
> but I don't know where I can see the text.
> Is it possible to see the position of text foramt?

Try Edit->Enter command... and type 'copy'
This will put a text formatted board in your windows clipboard,
and you can paste it in in your text editor.

> One more question.
> How can I know the newest version is distrbuted?

Just check my web page: http://home.online.no/~oeysteij/

The snapshot there is dated in YYMMDD format. The latest is 020704.
If you check the ChangeLog in the cvs, you will be able to see
all changes to the program. I usually make new builds when something
is changed cvs. Builds are usually done in the morning (CET) of working
days. There won't be any new builds this week though!

Oeystein


07/07 (Sun) 22:10 (no.12)

On Wed, Jun 19, 2002 at 07:22:55PM -0700, Mirori wrote
> Hi,
> I have 2 questions, today.
>
> 1.
> I'm trying to play with GUNBG.
> My dice is 5-6, and I want to move 24/18 18/13,
> but GUNBG never could be moved 18/13.
> What's wrong?

I'm not sure I understand your question.

>From the screenshot it appears that you've moved 24/18 with the 6 and
you haven't moved the 5 yet. gnubg shows that you've so far moved
"24/18". It's shown in red as the move is incomplete --- you'll not be
allowed to lift the dice.

Joern


07/07 (Sun) 22:11 (no.13)

On Fri, Jun 21, 2002 at 02:54:22PM -0700, Mirori wrote
> >On Wed, Jun 19, 2002 at 07:22:55PM -0700, Mirori wrote
>
> >> I'm trying to play with GUNBG.
> >> My dice is 5-6, and I want to move 24/18 18/13,
> >> but GUNBG never could be moved 18/13.
> >> What's wrong?
> >
> >I'm not sure I understand your question.
> >
> >>From the screenshot it appears that you've moved 24/18 with the 6 and
> >you haven't moved the 5 yet. gnubg shows that you've so far moved
> >"24/18". It's shown in red as the move is incomplete --- you'll not be
> >allowed to lift the dice.
> >
> >Joern Thyssen, PhD
>
> I tried to move 18/13, but GUNBG sounded error beep.
> GUNBG allows to move only 13/8 or 8/3.
> Sometimes, this happening occurs.

Was it the opening move?

Are you sure that you hadn't already moved the 6? From the picture it
certainly looks like it.

Joern


07/07 (Sun) 22:11 (no.14)

On Fri, Jun 21, 2002 at 03:33:32PM -0700, Mirori wrote

> This picture is opening move.
> I moved 24/18 for 6, and I couldn't move 18/13 for 5.
> This happens also in the middle of a game, sometimes.
> A piece cannot be put on the place with which five or more pieces
> have overlapped on it.

How do you "move" the chequer? Do you click on it or do you drag it?

If you click on it, you must make sure that "show higher die on the
left" is selected and "allow dragging to illegal points" is de-selected
on the "general" tab in "Settings->Appearance".

Joern


07/07 (Sun) 22:12 (no.15)

On Fri, Jun 21, 2002 at 04:53:41PM -0700, Mirori wrote
> This is same happening which GUNBG doesn't allow to move 6/3 for 3,
> because No.3 point is over 5 pieces.
> If you need more picture, I'll send you.

Have you by any chance activated Egyptian rule (Settings->Egyption
Rule)?

Joern


07/07 (Sun) 22:12 (no.16)

On Sun, Jun 23, 2002 at 01:06:35AM -0700, Mirori wrote

> I think I hadn't activated Egyptian rule, but it was selected.
> After I de-selected it, it was no problem.
> Thank you for your replying kindly.

Remember to save the new settings :-)

> I have another question.
> I don't find how I can see the pip count.

It's not shown on the board, but if you select "Analysis->Pip Count",
gnubg wil shown the pip count in the status bar in the bottom of the
window.

Joern




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